Language in Cephiro

[VKiera]

Soooo after some major meta dumping on poor Ko on the group chat I thought I'd just drop it all here instead, I'm interested in hearing other's thoughts on this.

I've been kicking around the idea of language in Cephiro. I mean, by default, one could assume they're all speaking Japanese? But a few times it's pointed out that Cephiro has it's own special words, ie 'Sol' 'Palu' ect that are very different from the English "Magic Knights" that's actually an important plot point in the manga. So I've always wondered, does Cephiro have its own language? We see a possible written version of it here in the first pages between the stages in the newer prints of the manga by Dark Horse. If you look squint a bit you can make out the words 'magic knight rayearth' about middle of the way down.

Pretty sure that's suppose to 'Cephiran script'

So do they have their own language? Is Japanese just the 'common tongue' to use a Tolkin phrase, that all the countries speak along with their own native languages? Does Autozam use English? Arabic in Chizeta (with a southern drawl? XD) and Chinese in Fahren?

Also if they do all speak Japanese does that mean the Magic Knights always come from Japan on Earth and none of the other nations?

I was most curious because I had a fic idea with several of the character's on Autozam and Umi has to end up translating a lot because she's the one most proficient in speaking English xD

[Revolutionaren]

I like to believe there's a universal translation device mcguffin that translates everything. Like how Mokona in Tsubasa does. So, whilst the girls can talk to everyone they certainly can't read or write the local language.

As for the other countries... They probably have their own languages that resemble nothing on earth, haha.

[suzanami]

I've always hand-waved it with the "magical interpreter" thing too.  partly because thinking too hard about it gives me a headache.  I think as the girls spend more and more time in Cephiro (and become more aware of this magical oral interpreter in place, like they've known it was there but now they start to recognize the discrepancy) and become more like honorary citizens, so to speak, they realize they start to actually speak Cephiran words and phrases and after some years they get to there they intentionally speak the two languages, and the "interpreter" ceases to be necessary.  some of the Cephirans close to them work to learn Japanese as well, Clef especially so and he is eventually quite good.

same with the other countries, I doubt they're speaking Cephiran.  I think they all speak the same language for convenience's sake in the storytelling :x  I like the idea of a common tongue in that universe though, I think it makes the most sense.

I know Down has a mess of thoughts about this but I can't remember where it was XD

tbh I try to avoid the topic entirely when actually ficcing or whathaveyou because it's too nebulous and complicated to even touch on and my headcanon about it is sketchy at best, so I just take it for granted.

[Mokonalord]

I see a few six point stars and one or two bass clefs in that script. This amuses me.

[suzanami]

I see a few six point stars and one or two bass clefs in that script. This amuses me.

I like to think it's magic being woven into the text.

[VKiera]

I like to believe there's a universal translation device mcguffin that translates everything. Like how Mokona in Tsubasa does. So, whilst the girls can talk to everyone they certainly can't read or write the local language.

As for the other countries... They probably have their own languages that resemble nothing on earth, haha.

Interesting, I had considered what you're talking about with Mokona as it functions in TRC, would be kinda hilarious if it worked like that in MKR. Anytime Mokona got too far away from them they'd no longer understand eachother, haha. 

Maybe it's just a built in mechanic/mcguffin in Cephiro, like Suz said. Though I still would really like to play around with the different languages, especially for the other countries.

I think we get a glimpse of what some of Autozam's lettering looks like in the anime and maybe the manga? It's brief and on the computer screen on the NSX, so it could just be something that's computer code/tech related and not what their language looks like written. It was geometric in shape and design if I recall. Humm... Though I think I'll keep the 'common language' idea and store that away for another day.

I'm pretty sure Clamp didn't think that hard about this though, lol, as with most stories, comes with suspension of belief clause for things like this.

Magic being in the Cephirian text is a cool thought though, like the whole 'power/magic of language' thing that gets brought up in xxxholic a few times.

[Somariel]

Soooo after some major meta dumping on poor Ko on the group chat I thought I'd just drop it all here instead, I'm interested in hearing other's thoughts on this.

I've been kicking around the idea of language in Cephiro. I mean, by default, one could assume they're all speaking Japanese? But a few times it's pointed out that Cephiro has it's own special words, ie 'Sol' 'Palu' ect that are very different from the English "Magic Knights" that's actually an important plot point in the manga. So I've always wondered, does Cephiro have its own language? We see a possible written version of it here in the first pages between the stages in the newer prints of the manga by Dark Horse. If you look squint a bit you can make out the words 'magic knight rayearth' about middle of the way down.

Pretty sure that's suppose to 'Cephiran script'

So do they have their own language? Is Japanese just the 'common tongue' to use a Tolkin phrase, that all the countries speak along with their own native languages? Does Autozam use English? Arabic in Chizeta (with a southern drawl? XD) and Chinese in Fahren?

Also if they do all speak Japanese does that mean the Magic Knights always come from Japan on Earth and none of the other nations?

I was most curious because I had a fic idea with several of the character's on Autozam and Umi has to end up translating a lot because she's the one most proficient in speaking English xD

So in that image, I'm pretty sure that "Rayearth" is the very first word, the sixth line down consists of the separate phrases "Magic Knight" and "Selece", and the first word of the seventh line down is "Windam".

[VKiera]

So in that image, I'm pretty sure that "Rayearth" is the very first word, the sixth line down consists of the separate phrases "Magic Knight" and "Selece", and the first word of the seventh line down is "Windam".

Hee, yea I noticed that. I'm also mildly curious about the smaller sorta scribblly part four lines up from the bottom. Cephiro spelling mistakes? XD

[suzanami]

I started to say something about that in my first reply but just started babbling with no point, but the whole thing kind of looks to me like the Legend of the Magic Knights.  though I wonder why Rayearth's name is so far from the other key Earth words.

in the manga they comment that Rayearth means "shining land" in one of Earth's languages, and idk I wonder if the deeper meaning of the name is being, like, spoken over the whole of the text?  like... mm, not quite a blessing, but something that is wanted for Cephiro?  I'm explaining myself terribly.

I love the scribbles!  it's such a good touch??  like someone went back later and decided that part needed to be fleshed out better.

[dinosaurjam]

I started to say something about that in my first reply but just started babbling with no point, but the whole thing kind of looks to me like the Legend of the Magic Knights.  though I wonder why Rayearth's name is so far from the other key Earth words.

in the manga they comment that Rayearth means "shining land" in one of Earth's languages, and idk I wonder if the deeper meaning of the name is being, like, spoken over the whole of the text?  like... mm, not quite a blessing, but something that is wanted for Cephiro?  I'm explaining myself terribly.

I love the scribbles!  it's such a good touch??  like someone went back later and decided that part needed to be fleshed out better.

This is SUCH a good theory. As well as your earlier comment that certain symbols might indicate magic being woven into the text.

It's not something I've really hammered out, but I like the idea of magic being infused into a lot of things in Cephiro. It's a land where will determines all, and in that sense I think everyone in Cephiro has magic in them. Maybe not the controlled, deliberate, spell-based flashy kind we see many of our main characters use, but magic of a sort. And for Cephrians as a people, to infuse their writings, stories, and more with some of that magic is like... maybe just often an intuitive thing? But especially in their writing, now that I've read this thread. Like the magic is there - why not thread it into written documents and stories?

[Down]

I looooooove the idea of magic in writing aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah MAGIC BOOKS

(Has anyone compared this image with the ones of Fai's magic when he writes it in the air in Tsubasa? I remember it being pretty similar but I don't think I remembered to go back to do a comparision. If so - Cephiro as a source of magical practise and theory throughout the universe YES PLEASE. XDD If not, well, I can dream anyway. Like - other people can't necessarily use Cephiran magic, but the WAYS Cephirans use magic and think about it are looked on as best practice by others so much that the Cephiran writing system is widely used as a system for writing magic?)

(Or they could have a seperate one for writing magic, that would be funnnnnnn)

THAT SAID I can't find any of my ranting about Cephiran linguistics on the internet BLAST AND BOTHER IT.  BUT yes I think there's a translation spell in effect which is part of Emeraude's summoning, perhaps, but they're hearing japanese when the people speaking are NOT speaking Japanese. The 'Magic Knight' etc english loan-words are loan-words borrowed into Cephiran as titles, and titles seem to be the things they actually 'hear' - in the manga, the titles are written out as kanji for meaning but the sounds are katakana, like they hear the strange word and get some idea what it means maybe but it's not actually translating into them hearing 'madoushi' when Clef's called 'Guru' with the 'madoushi' kanji. Because titles are kinda untranslatable they were left out? And loan words are written in a loan-alphabet when Cephirans are writing them down, in the same way as Japanese uses katakana to sound out loan words, and that's why rayearth, magic knight selece, and windam are all visible in the text~ though highly 'styalised' because the roman alphabet has been used in Cephiro for millenia now and that's how it's altered?

Personally I think the scribble looks like a diagram of the solar system, and that it's a bit of a really old text or a banned book - maybe one for the Guru or the Pillar? - which gives the origin of the magic knights and the full story of their role and why it was created...

Apart from that I apparently really want to say that Clef's signature should totally be a bass clef. XDDD (OR a tenor/alto clef, given his voice isn't THAT deep? XDDD) (Without the stave you can't tell the difference between alto and tenor because it's the same symbol on a different line, but whatever if I say it's a tenor clef it's a tenor clef anyway right??)

[VKiera]

Down you adorable dork, about time you got in here!

I took to some digging and pulled this up.

   

They do have a similar design, but you can prolly crack that up to being drawn by the same people/person. I would say Fai's (Fye?) magic letters have more sharp strokes to them and fewer curves.  But let that headcanon roll girl, sounds cool to me.

Also, the translation spell does sound like the best idea, I guess it just wears off eventually? Or maybe they just have the 'Will' to understand, so they do? Interesting if that applied only to Cephiro and like they visited Autozam or Chizeta and suddenly no one understands what each is saying. XD Though Lantis had no problem in Autozam so??? eh *shrugs*

I'm giggling like mad about Celf signing his name with a...clef....that's just precious and awesome.